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+---- Thread: Consequences (/showthread.php?tid=1074)
RE: Consequences - Valiant_Destiny - 08-19-2011
(08-19-2011, 01:19 PM)kta Wrote: Maybe the thing called "real life" can be seen as a example eh? :D
KTA
Totally agree here! If you walk up to someone bigger and badder than you in the street and spit, insult, or call their Harley, cute.. You might get your ass-kicked. Same goes for here.
I disagree that playing a low-level character like they already have some sort of reputation, or even the slightest ounce of power is right. We do not start at level 7-10 here.. we start at level 1, chased by slavers and unable to defend ourselves from their attacks. At starting level, or even low level, we are not in any place to go around bossing on people. That should come through dedication to the server, and time spent building a reputation, levels, equipment, background, etc.
Which these people that are busting your lip for smarting off have probably already done.
Note: If I couldn't even defend myself from the slavers and had to come here under protection of another source.. than I probably am not going to think I'm in any situation of even a speck of legitimate Power. I'm more likely scared to death of this place, and any Skull wearing Cyrist with a HellHound on a flaming chain leash.
RE: Consequences - Purulent Carcass - 08-19-2011
If you go into a bar and mouth off to some guy who then proceeds to wipe the floor with your face because, much to your ignorant suprise they were a black belt in karate, you deserve what you get for not looking before you leap. If its ic to mouth off to people who are obviously more powerful than you, then it better be ic to expect whatever comes next.
For example:
Some people lately just haven't gotten that you don't just walk up to Red Wizards and start shooting the shit with them unless you happen to have a long standing relationship with them. Expecting one of these wizards to just calmly listen to your rant is ludicrous and you are far better off avoiding them entirely if you can, diplomacy is a tricky card to play but it CAN work. Same goes for anyone who obviously exudes power. IRL do you think in terms of level when you are considering how smart it is to go fuck with a police officer who is working? No, normal people don't do it. Why? Because it's stupid to tempt fate that way.
If you live on the edge and want adventure, by all means... go give Maurin a wedgie, see where it gets you. (Wether or not Maurin wears underwear is not up for discussion on this forum)
RE: Consequences - Animayhem - 08-19-2011
(08-19-2011, 07:10 PM)Purulent Carcass Wrote: If you go into a bar and mouth off to some guy who then proceeds to wipe the floor with your face because, much to your ignorant suprise they were a black belt in karate, you deserve what you get for not looking before you leap. If its ic to mouth off to people who are obviously more powerful than you, then it better be ic to expect whatever comes next.
For example:
Some people lately just haven't gotten that you don't just walk up to Red Wizards and start shooting the shit with them unless you happen to have a long standing relationship with them. Expecting one of these wizards to just calmly listen to your rant is ludicrous and you are far better off avoiding them entirely if you can, diplomacy is a tricky card to play but it CAN work. Same goes for anyone who obviously exudes power. IRL do you think in terms of level when you are considering how smart it is to go fuck with a police officer who is working? No, normal people don't do it. Why? Because it's stupid to tempt fate that way.
If you live on the edge and want adventure, by all means... go give Maurin a wedgie, see where it gets you. (Wether or not Maurin wears underwear is not up for discussion on this forum)
Yes and has been mentioned on the opposite side of the coin if it is in your character to play the bastard and bully and the person you are picking on decides to turn and leave (meaning the bully started it not the player being verbally attacked) they should be allowed to as by your verbal assasult they got the hint of your personality.
RE: Consequences - Purulent Carcass - 08-19-2011
Quote:Yes and has been mentioned on the opposite side of the coin if it is in your character to play the bastard and bully and the person you are picking on decides to turn and leave (meaning the bully started it not the player being verbally attacked) they should be allowed to as by your verbal assasult they got the hint of your personality.
Yet this situation you describe hardly ever happens, got to wonder. Also, where in the evil adventurers rulebook does it say to let the victim get away?
In all seriousness, I myself do not go out of my way to pick on people they come to me in droves. Death is rarer here than most realize, it normally doesn't happen in groups. What I personally get a lot, is some guy will show up thinking he is amusing (and he very well might be) and says something completely off to one of my PCs. I'll normally give a verbal warning first and then someone is set on fire. If said (victim) wishes to run away at that point, I normally let them. Reality is diffrent, what usually happens, they come right back.
RE: Consequences - Karilynn - 08-19-2011
A couple comments:
1. This is an RP mod set in Thay. If you're not being respectful of a Red Wizard, a legionnaire, or someone else of position, or disobeying laws of Thay then be ready to accept the consequences. (see Githzerai Monk's post below for a good way to consider this from the perspective of the PC who is in the position of authority).
2. I've seen a few public OOC complaints about RP that has gone in, during the course of that RP. Please keep in mind that if something has gone on in character, a running string of public OOC comments complaining about the unfairness of it all just disrupts the RP atmosphere of those trying to enjoy the game. If there is a legitimate concern over something done IC that you think was over the line, then talk to the PC involved (tells if needed) and if that doesn't resolve the issue, work with a DM to discuss the problem. Just keep in mind, this is Thay, there are many evil PCs about, so some things that might seem harsh are in character for those PCs.
RE: Consequences - Githzerai Monk - 08-19-2011
(08-19-2011, 07:10 PM)Purulent Carcass Wrote: If you live on the edge and want adventure, by all means... go give Maurin a wedgie, see where it gets you. (Wether or not Maurin wears underwear is not up for discussion on this forum)
AHAHAHAHA!
My thoughts on this are that PCs should follow some sort of guideline. New players can make the mistake that all the other PCs on this PW want to help them. Us players do (And I'm happy to give directions to sections of the city via tell once PCs have bought a map, or help other PCs with lore that their PC would know), but as both of my red wizard PCs have hinted at occasionally, red wizards are not tour guides, same holds true for many other PCs.
The following process seems about right to me, though it shouldn't be followed like a law, it's more a guideline. It is not in any way complete and just what I come up with off the top of my head. Feel free to add to it or critique it. I'm in no way a model player, I've made my own mistakes as well. Making these mistakes is not an enjoyable experience, I encourage you to avoid it.
1) Give the other PC an IC warning that. "If you keep doing that, it might not end well for you." Some players aren't familiar with the idea of red wizards being the rulers of Thay, and this sometimes happens to Maurin. Being unaware of the setting alone is not reason to have your PC beaten to a pulp.
If a PC chooses to ignore a threat for any reason, that PC is completely open to have that threat carried out upon them. If they call the bluff, but it wasn't actually a bluff, then they cannot expect the other PC to act as if it was a bluff. Stage 1 and stage 2 are pretty close, don't think you have to stick with stage 1 for long.
2) Attempt to come up with some sort of punishment that will not render their character unplayable (Beating them down and not killing them usually suffices, but don't feel you can't get creative, carve your message into their scalp, disable them and then leave them at the mercy of someone nearer their level or simply some bystanders).
If you've tried methods that do not render the other PC unplayable, and the other PC persists in intentionally pissing off your PC, anything goes. Stage 2 and 3 are a lot further apart than 1 and 2, hang around on 2 for a reasonable amount of time before you head onwards to stage 3.
3) If after this they have not gotten the message, it's fair to say that you can kill, enslave, rob or do whatever your PC wishes to the other PC.
Proceed to stage 3 with caution, ensure that your PC has a -very- good reason to be doing harm that may be a little more permanently damaging to the other PC. If your PC is beaten down, they'll wake up in the morning and RP being sore, but they won't have any actual ill effects that negate any effort the player has put into the PC. However if they're robbed blind, killed or enslaved, the effects are much more permanent and character-breaking.
Don't break out of character to follow these guidelines. Pre-meditated attack would be fair to skip straight to the attacking segment, particularly if the attacker is attacking from stealth.
RE: Consequences - kta - 08-19-2011
(08-19-2011, 10:25 PM)Karilynn Wrote: If there is a legitimate concern over something done IC that you think was over the line, then talk to the PC involved (tells if needed) and if that doesn't resolve the issue, work with a DM to discuss the problem.
If any player finds himself in such a position - talk to me. Present your case, back it up with screenshots and lets settle things like mature people, not like a bunch of angry 10 year old.
KTA
RE: Consequences - Poet - 08-20-2011
As a new player to the server, I agree with much of this. I've had dealing with people who have threatened my character on a regular basis for calling them 'Lad' or 'Mate'. Part of this is a growing experience, as I learn both OOCly and ICly the rules and workings of the server.
However, there was one grievance that didn't sit well with me. My character had just transitioned and two folk were conversing right in front of it. I clicked a point to move to and my character walked through between them. He was immediately hit and KO'd by one of the people conversing. I didn't get a tell or any warning. Being my first day to the server when it happened, it felt much more like trying to be a bully than playing your character. The person could have warned or threatened my character, and he probably would have made sure not to do it again. However, when people get too friendly to attack others for such minor reasons, it's when the lines begin to be blurred.
The above was meant to be an example. As stated , I'm all for consequences and PvP when necessary, but first we have to identify other routes and options available for our characters instead of just attacking, because as you can see, people get too trigger friendly and it can tarnish someone else's experience.
RE: Consequences - Sten - 08-20-2011
I understand that it's annoying, but to be fair it's quite rude to walk between people who are tradeing or talking.
-Sten
RE: Consequences - Balanor - 08-20-2011
Violence for someone walking in front of you is not acceptable. ESPECIALLY if no warning tell or IC actions were taken prior to it occurring. I don't care if it was a newbie, a long-term player, or even a DM playing that character. This is borderline griefing in my mind no matter who did it. If this is true it is very upsetting to me as this is *not* the way I want new players welcomed to the PW.
Poet, if you have logs of this encounter and/or screenshots, send them to KTA and myself.
If this situation is true, and judging from some of the comments I've seen so far, then it seems to me that an attitude of 'violence is an acceptable answer to anything' is becoming a perhaps too-often-used method of 'teaching' someone the ways of Thay. Granted it's an evil place, but be a good person and have a little OOC consideration for players that may be new or have perhaps made a simple mistake. And just because your PC may be evil does not mean it has to act like an asshole either. Some of the best evil characters (in my opinion) are those that are not brutes and use manipulation or any of 100 other 'evil' methods to teach someone a lesson rather than beating them down for something as trivial as walking in front of you. Of course if the other PC is just being a belligerent jerk or violence is the only way they will appear to learn their lesson...well...then your PC needs to do what it must.
I also think this is a good time to make sure that everyone reading this post review the CvC/PvP Guidelines because I don't want to start running into (more?) situations like Poet's example where they are not being followed.